Why God's people suffer

<body topmargin=0 leftmargin=0 marginheight=0 marginwidth=0> <table cellpadding=0 cellspacing=0 border=0><tr> <td valign="top" colspan=2 height=125 BGCOLOR="#996699" TEXT="#080000" bgproperties="fixed" background="03f467d1erlcll.png"> <div> <FONT SIZE="5" COLOR="#FFFFFF" FACE="Arial" ><B>VoiceInWilderness.info</B></FONT><B>     </B><B>|     </B><A HREF="index.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="VoiceInWilderness.info"><B>home</B></A></div> <div> <A HREF="ernest_martin_lectures.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Ernest L. Martin Audio Lectures">Ernest Martin Lectures</A>   |   <A HREF="peterdenials.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Peters Denials of Jesus">PeterDenials</A>   |   <A HREF="resurrectionharmony.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Harmony of the Events from the Lords Res">ResurrectionHarmony</A>   |   <B>whyGodsPeopleSuffer</B>  |  </div> <div> </div> </td> </tr><tr> <td valign="top" width=399 style="border-right: 1px solid #CCCCCC;" BGCOLOR="#FFFFFF" TEXT="#080000"> <div> <U>Why God's people suffer</U><U> </U></div> <div> Deuteronomy 8:1-6</div> <div> 1 All the commandments which I command thee this day shall ye observe to do, that ye may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the LORD sware unto your fathers.</div> <div> 2 <A NAME="2"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A>  And thou shalt remember all the way which the LORD thy God led thee these forty years in the wilderness, to humble thee, to prove thee, to know what was in thine heart, whether thou would keep his commandments, or no.</div> <div> 3 <A NAME="deut8_3"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A>  And he humbled thee, and suffered thee to hunger, and fed thee with manna, which thou knew not, neither did thy fathers know; that he might make thee know that man doth not live by bread only, but by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the LORD doth man live.</div> <div> 4 <A NAME="4"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A>  Thy raiment waxed not old upon thee, neither did thy foot swell, these forty years.</div> <div> 5 <A NAME="5"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A>  Thou shalt also consider in thine heart, that, as a man chastens his son, so the LORD thy God chastens thee.</div> <div> 6  Therefore thou shalt keep the commandments of the LORD thy God, to walk in his ways, and to fear him.</div> <div> ...</div> <div> 16 <A NAME="16"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A>  Who fed thee in the wilderness with manna, which thy fathers knew not, that he might humble thee, and that he might prove thee, to do thee good at thy latter end;</div> <bR> <div> 2Cor 12:7 <A NAME="2cor12_7"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A> And that I might not be exalted by the exceeding greatness of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn for the flesh, a messenger of Satan that he might buffet me, that I might not be exalted.</div> <div>  8 For this I thrice besought the Lord that it might depart from me.</div> <div>  9 And he said to me, My grace suffices thee; for my power is perfected in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather boast in my weaknesses, that the power of the Christ may dwell upon me. (DBY)</div> <bR> <div> <A HREF="psalm_13.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Psalm 13 Overcomer How long will You f">Psalm 13:1-3</A></div> <div> 1 <A NAME="ps13_1"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A> How long will You forget me?</div> <div> O LORD, for'ere <I>it seems to be.</I> </div> <div> How long You hide Your face from me</div> <div> <I>while I in darkness grope for Thee?</I></div> <div> 2 How long shall I counsel my soul, </div> <div> My heart daily having sorrow? </div> <div> How long shall my adversary </div> <div> still be exalted over me?</div> <div> 3  Look carefully <I>and </I>answer me, </div> <div> O Lord my God, enlighten me,</div> <div> lest I should sleep the <I>sleep of</I> death, </div> <div> <I>while for my soul, I get no rest.</I></div> <bR> <div> The <A HREF="http://cyberhymnal.org/htm/s/a/sandtime.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="http://cyberhymnal.org/htm/s/a/sandtime.">Sands of Time are Sinking </A> <A NAME="sands"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A>by Anne Cousin stanza 8</div> <div> But flowers need nights' cool darkness, </div> <div> the moonlight and the dew;</div> <div> So Christ, from one who loved it,</div> <div> His shining oft withdrew:</div> <div> And then, for cause of absence</div> <div> my troubled soul I scanned</div> <div> But glory shadeless shineth </div> <div> in Immanuel’s land.</div> <bR> <div> 1John 2:3-6 <A NAME="1jn2_3"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A></div> <div> 3 And hereby we know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.</div> <div>  4 He that says, I know him, and does not keep his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him;</div> <div>  5 but whoever keeps his word, in him verily the love of God is perfected. Hereby we know that we are in him.</div> <div>  6 He that says he abides in him ought, even as *he* walked, himself also so to walk. (DBY)</div> <bR> <div> Psalm 17:3 <A NAME="ps17_3"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A> </div> <div> You have proved my heart, You have visited</div> <div> in the night; You have examined me.</div> <div> You're finding nothing. That which I have thought,</div> <div> out from my mouth, it shall not proceed.</div> <bR> <div>  <A NAME="matt4_4"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A>But he answering said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word which goes out through God's mouth. (Mat 4:4 DBY)</div> <bR> <div> James 2:8-13 <A NAME="james2_6"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A></div> <div>  8 If indeed ye keep the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself, ye do well.</div> <div>  9 But if ye have respect of persons, ye commit sin, being convicted by the law as transgressors.</div> <div>  10 For whoever shall keep the whole law and shall offend in one point, he has come under the guilt of breaking all.</div> <div>  11 For he who said, Thou shalt not commit adultery, said also, Thou shalt not kill. Now if thou dost not commit adultery, but kills, thou art become transgressor of the law.</div> <div>  12 So speak ye, and so act, as those that are to be judged by the law of liberty;</div> <div>  13 for judgment will be without mercy to him that has shown no mercy. Mercy glories over judgment. (DBY)</div> <bR> <div> Deut 7:17 <A NAME="deut7_17"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A>  Ye shall diligently keep the commandments of the LORD your God, and his testimonies, and his statutes, which he hath commanded thee.</div> <div> 18  And thou shalt do that which is right and good in the sight of the LORD: that it may be well with thee, and that thou mayest go in and possess the good land which the LORD sware unto thy fathers,</div> <bR> <div> 1 Corinthians 10:1-13  <A NAME="1co10_1"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A></div> <div> For I would not have you ignorant, brethren, that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;</div> <div>  2 and all were baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;</div> <div>  3 and all ate the same spiritual food,</div> <div>  4 and all drank the same spiritual drink, for they drank of a spiritual rock which followed them: (now the rock was the Christ;)</div> <div>  5 yet God was not pleased with the most of them, for they were strewed in the desert.</div> <div>  6 But these things happened as types of us, that we should not be lusters after evil things, as they also lusted.</div> <div>  7 Neither be ye idolaters, as some of them; as it is written, The people sat down to eat and to drink, and rose up to play.</div> <div>  8 Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed fornication, and fell in one day three and twenty thousand.</div> <div>  9 Neither let us tempt the Christ, as some of them tempted, and perished by serpents.</div> <div>  10 Neither murmur ye, as some of them murmured, and perished by the destroyer.</div> <div>  11 Now all these things happened to them as types, and have been written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the ages are come.</div> <div>  12 So that let him that thinks that he stands take heed lest he fall.</div> <div>  13 No temptation has taken you but such as is according to man's nature; and God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above what ye are able to bear, but will with the temptation make the issue also, so that ye should be able to bear it. (1Co 10:1-13 DBY)</div> <bR> <div> 1Peter 1:6-7 <A NAME="1pe1_6"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A></div> <div> 6 Wherein ye exult, for a little while at present, if needed, put to grief by various trials,</div> <div>  7 that the proving of your faith, much more precious than of gold which perishes, though it be proved by fire, be found to praise and glory and honor in the revelation of Jesus Christ:</div> <div>  (1Pe 1:6-7 DBY)</div> <bR> <div> 2Cor 1:3-7 <A NAME="2cor1_3"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A></div> <div> 3 Blessed be God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies, and the God of all comfort;</div> <div>  4 Who comforts us in all our tribulation, that we may be able to comfort them which are in any trouble, by the comfort wherewith we ourselves are comforted of God.</div> <div>  5 For as the sufferings of Christ abound in us, so our consolation also abounds by Christ.</div> <div>  6 And whether we be afflicted, it is for your consolation and salvation, which is effectual in the enduring of the same sufferings which we also suffer: or whether we be comforted, it is for your consolation and salvation.</div> <div>  7 And our hope of you is stedfast, knowing, that as ye are partakers of the sufferings, so shall ye be also of the consolation.  (2Co 1:3-7 KJV)</div> <bR> <div> Colossians 1:24 <A NAME="col1_24"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A> Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and fill up on my part that which is lacking of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church; (Col 1:24 ASV)</div> <bR> <div> 10 <A NAME="philip3_10"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A> That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death; (Philip 3:10 KJV)</div> <bR> <div> Rev 3:19-22 <A NAME="rev3_19"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A></div> <div> 19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.</div> <div>  20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.</div> <div>  21 To him that overcomes will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.</div> <div>  22 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches. (Rev 3:19-22 KJV)</div> <bR> <div> Heb 12:5-13 <A NAME="heb12_5"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A></div> <div> 5 And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaks unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:</div> <div>  6 For whom the Lord loveth he chastens, and scourges every son whom he receives.</div> <div>  7 If ye endure chastening, God deals with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chastens not?</div> <div>  8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.</div> <div>  9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?</div> <div>  10 For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.</div> <div>  11 Now no chastening for the present seems to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yields the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.</div> <div>  12 Wherefore lift up the hands which hang down, and the feeble knees;</div> <div>  13 And make straight paths for your feet, lest that which is lame be turned out of the way; but let it rather be healed. (Heb 12:5-13 KJV)</div> <bR> <div> 2 <A NAME="jam3_2"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A> For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body. (Jam 3:2 KJV)</div> <bR> <div> Matt 6:21-23 <A NAME="matt6_23"><IMG BORDER="0" SRC="1x1.gif" HEIGHT="1" ALIGN="bottom" WIDTH="1" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0" ></A></div> <div> 21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.</div> <div>  22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.</div> <div>  23 But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness! (Mat 6:21-23 KJV)</div> </td> <td valign="top" height=355 width="100%" BGCOLOR="#FFFFFF" TEXT="#080000"> <div> <B>Three Reasons God's People Suffer</B></div> <div> In Deuteronomy chapter 8, Moses prepares the children of Israel to enter the promised land. He tells them to remember the suffering that they went through these 40 years in the wilderness and tells us 3 reasons why they suffered:</div> <div> <B>1. To humble us to prove us to know what is in our heart whether we would keep His commandments or not</B> (<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#2" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">Deut 8:2</A>).</div> <div> The Lord gives us suffering to humble us (<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#2cor12_7" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">2Cor 12:7</A>). It is easy to think I am following the Lord absolutely when I am successful. We think that if people no longer have reason to admire us, then that will be bad for the Lord's testimony. This humbling proves us. The real testimony is how we handle suffering. Do we then stop following the Lord until He gives us what we want? If we are able by the Lord's grace to be genuinely joyful yet honest, that is a testimony of the Lord. </div> <div> Sometimes the Lord may humble us by withholding His shining (<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#ps13_1" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">Ps 13:1-3</A>; "<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#sands" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">The Sands of Time are Sinking" stanza 8</A>). </div> <div> In <A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#ps17_3" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">Ps 17:3</A>, David says that the Lord proves our hearts. "You have examined me and find nothing" does not mean that there is nothing wrong with me.  According to the verse, David still had evil thoughts, but he did not agree with them to speak them or much less act on them.</div> <div> We need to keep the Lord's New Testament commandments (<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#1jn2_3" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">1Jn2:3-5</A>). Some Christians wrongly think that we only need to keep commandments if the Spirit tells us to, or that only the commandments which are emphasized by an apostle are important for us to keep (<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#matt4_4" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">Matt 4:4</A>; <A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#james2_6" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">James 2:10</A>) . Commandments are not optional. We need to be restricted by the Lord's commandments in His word and we also need to please Him in all things (<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#deut7_17" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">Deut 7:18</A>).</div> <div> Proving is a test. Just as the older generation of the Israelites failed the test, so Christians can also fail the test (<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#1co10_1" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">1Cor 10:5-6</A>; <A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#1pe1_6" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">1Peter 1:6-7</A>).</div> <div> <B>2. To teach us new things in the word. </B>(<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#deut8_3" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">Deut 8:3</A>)</div> <bR> <div> God humbles us and causes us to suffer lack and marvelously meets our needs in order to teach us divine truths. In order to receive revelation from the Lord we must be in a humble state and remain humble after receiving revelation (<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#2cor12_7" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">2Cor12:7</A>). With man this is not possible, but it is with God. The revelation must be based upon and agree with every word out of the mouth of God. If we think we see something from the Lord, we need to see if the Word really says that. If it is in the Word, we need to see if there are any contradicting verses.</div> <bR> <div> The things that the Lord teaches us may be something that we or others have never seen before. We are taught new truths experientially in order to comfort others (<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#2cor1_3" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">2Cor1:4</A>) and build up the church, His body (<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#col1_24" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">Col 1:24</A>). The Lord teaches us to know Him and His resurrection power while we fellowship with Him in His sufferings (<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#philip3_10" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">Philip 3:10</A>).</div> <bR> <div> Here, the specific truth God taught the Israelites by their suffering was that we do not live by bread alone but by every thing that proceeds out of God's mouth. We should not spend a day without reading the word. Reading the word as a part of reading commentaries is good, but does not meet this requirement because we need every word of God.</div> <div> The happiest times in my life are not when there is an abundance of bread, but when there is God's speaking. Every word of God is trustworthy. You can depend on it to stand on its truth. </div> <bR> <div> In the midst of long suffering and being humbled, the Lord's care is still there (<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#4" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">v4</A>). There is no record that the children of Israel even recognized the miracle that their clothes did not wear out nor their feet swell during 40 years of desert travel. We should have our eyes open for such miracles.</div> <bR> <div> 3. <B>To chasten us </B>(<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#5" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">Deut 8:5</A>)</div> <bR> <div> We all commit sins and make mistakes (<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#jam3_2" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">James 3:2</A>). The Lord chastens us for our good (<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#16" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">Deut 8:16</A>; <A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#heb12_5" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">Heb 12:5-11</A>; <A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#rev3_19" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">Rev 3:19</A>). I need to question whether what I am doing for the Lord is really His will. Is it really what the Bible says? Are there verses that contradict? Am I forgetting about or excusing myself of other verses? (<A HREF="whygodspeoplesuffer_l.htm#matt6_23" TARGET="TRLX_Left" TITLE="Why Gods people suffer">Matt 6:23</A>)</div> <bR> <div> <B>Post comment:</B></div> <div>  <form action="http://csbmail.globalscape.com/cgi-bin/csbmail/csbmail.pl" method="POST" enctype="application/x-www-form-urlencoded"><input type="hidden" name="tlx_SortOrder" value="name,email,city,state,comments"><input type="hidden" name="tlx_FormIndex" value="1"><input type="hidden" name="tlx_OKMessage" value="I'll review your comments before posting. 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